Public opinion on China's position regarding the Russia-Ukraine conflict is polarized. While many express strong support for China and criticize Western influence, reflecting a belief in shifting geopolitical power dynamics favoring China and Russia, others are critical of China's motivations, viewing it as opportunistic and potentially harmful to European relations. Notably, commenters admire the Chinese ambassador's composure in contrast to critical perceptions of U.S. media treatment.

China

United States

European Union

China's official position is to remain neutral between Russia and Ukraine, believing that the eastward expansion of NATO has undermined Russia's security demands, which has led to the Russia-Ukraine conflict. As for the Chinese people, I don't know what politicians or scholars think, but from my experience chatting with my family, friends, and colleagues, people's direct impression of the Russia-Ukraine conflict is that "Russia has adopted too rough and reckless means, Ukraine is a fool who blindly believes in and approaches the West, and the West uses Ukraine to destroy Russia."

luoyeqiufengzao

No TV station dares to say this, it doesn't align with the official stance. But when it comes to independent media, it's hard to say - I don't have statistics, but I feel like 60% of people support Russia, 30% support Ukraine. The remaining 10% hold other views.

Sorry_Sort6059

Chinese people are just having pure hatred against NATO. Period. Anyone who are pro NATO or want to join NATO is potentially our enemies. The bloody day of NATO bombing the Chinese embassy in Belgrade will never be erased from Chinese people's memory.

You want CHINA to support someone who is eagerly to join NATO so it can become a part of the bully fucks? NEVER GONNA HAPPEN

groovyoung

I fully support the Ukrainian side for defending their country. But I do see the Russian side of this also. NATO was never supposed to be in the countries that were former Eastern soviet block. The west promised this then broke that promise. 

With such aggressive stance from western countries towards Russia it makes sense that they ran out of options to keep themselves safe. 

Ask US if Cuba still deserves to be treated so badly after almost 60 years

Capital_AT

China was demonized by reddit, always reminding T square, Uyhgurs, Taiwan etc.. including lying and exaggerating.  Basically western (nato) talking points. 

But now they have surprised pikachu face why China isn’t trusting them and don’t sanction Russia

miranaphoenix

Officially, China isn't strictly pro-Russia. China is like Nobita, who sells baseball bats to both Gian (the bully) and Suneo (the victim) while they're in the middle of a fight. Of course, you can argue that not sanctioning Russia is a form of support, and I wouldn't disagree with that.

On the public level. Yes, the pro-Russia voices are much louder. I think it boils down to a few key factors (in order of importance):Nationalist sentiment that is strongly anti-US and anti-NATO. A sort of nostalgia for the Soviet Union. A kind of Social Darwinist mindset comes from a deep-seated historical lesson in China: "if you are backward, you will be beaten." (落后就要挨打)

Ok-Tangerine-3358

I mean with [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/1axv9st/ua_pov_we_are_ready_to_stand_shoulder_to_shoulder/?share_id=L18WsVrQ4nWpaRmL_wFo6&amp;utm_content=1&amp;utm_medium=ios_app&amp;utm_name=ioscss&amp;utm_source=share&amp;utm_term=1) and [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/UkraineRussiaReport/comments/16h02gn/ua_pov_india_and_china_have_low_intellectual/?share_id=5Oxu6hW9shizw_c8KMEK3&amp;utm_content=1&amp;utm_medium=ios_app&amp;utm_name=ioscss&amp;utm_source=share&amp;utm_term=1) comming out of Ukraine goverment, idk what Chinese opinion should be.

R1donis

Russia has also taken loads of Chinese land.   

Oli99uk

TLDR: I prefer that Russia does not invade Ukraine, it's bad. But now that the war is already going on, I have no choice but to hope Russia wins.

Elaboration: China used to have good relations with Ukraine, buying many Soviet techs from them in the 1990s. And the war disrupts China's economic plans. Not to mention the basis of Russian argument for a independent East Ukraine since 2014 is with "ethnic self-determination". If the same logic is applied to other country, then all multi-ethnic countries should cease to exist. The West uses the exact same strategy to groom Tibetan and Uyghur separatists in China. President Tokayev of Kazakhstan, even if they're Russian ally, he also expressed concerns over this, because he has ethnic Russian people in his country too. Therefore, Russia is doing the same thing their enemies do, and we don't like that. However, since the war already started, NATO is behind Ukraine. NATO always antagonize China and uses the exact same strategy on us. I don't want China to be split into 7 pieces as they wanted, so I can't get behind the side with NATO. Therefore, overall I'm like trying to be neutral, but can't help leaning towards Russia a bit. I think the official stance of Chinese government is not that different from mine. Of course, by saying NATO I'm mainly referring to US and its anglosphere brethren, I have nothing against Greece for example even though it's part of NATO.

SectorRatioGeneral

This comment section made me think r/askchina is full of westoids rather than chinese themselves. The balatant US/NATO bias is a huge tell they are not Chinese.

ClueOwn1635

[deleted]

But I find it hypocritical that NATO (ie the US) has put missiles and forces in multiple countries around Russia but get in a panic when Russia tries to do the same. 

The war is basically the result of prejudice and backing them into a corner

Emotionally, I think this is an undoubted tragedy. Two former brotherly countries speaking similar languages ​​have become life-and-death opponents, and countless people who share similar cultures kill each other and die.

Simple_Original2320

We are very pragmatic people, and geopolitics is as pragmatic as it can get. China is pro-Russia doesn't mean it support Russia's invasion of Ukraine. It's simply that China and Russia has aligned geopolitical interest. The same logic, US and EU are pro-Ukraine doesn't mean they support what Ukraine stands for, it's simply because they have geopolitical interest opposite of Russia.

The sad part is while Ukrainians are dying and they think they are dying for their country, in fact, they are dying for a geopolitical contest between Russia and US/ EU. They think they are smart enough to play a power balance game between NATO and Russia, but when the dust is settled, no one will care about the interests of Ukrainians. 

One day, Ukrainians will wake up regretting not staying irrelevant in the geopolitical contest between Russian and US/EU.

statyin

The Ukrainians fully bought into Western lies about EU and NATO membership and antagonised Russia every which way they can. They allowed themselves to be used as a proxy against Russia, this is expected.

piscator111

I am in China (Not Chinese), I had this discussion, and upon asking "who attacked who" - answer: Ukraine, they  "attacked" due to the approach to the west. To the question from my side: Can we agree that Ukraine is a sovereign country - the answer "no"

Miserable-Win-6402

The Slavs (whether Russian or Ukrainian), when life gets a bit too comfortable, turn into a bunch of lazy drunkards. But when their country is threatened, they unleash astonishing energy. So why provoke them again and again?  

ParticularDiamond712

Opinions are mixed mostly because China cannot directly condone Russia’s actions

Actively supporting Russia’s annexation of a sovereign Ukraine would be weaponized against China to justify Taiwan independence, that a sovereign country’s territorial integrity can be violated 

This was why Macron drew so much derision comparing Taiwan to Ukraine in the recent Defence conference in Singapore. Taiwan and Ukraine are completely opposite sides of the spectrum of the concept of territorial integrity; and trying to compare the two is extremely hypocritical

danorcs

Agreeable-Heart3479

I’m entirely with Ukraine, no country should be invaded by a foreign power. But anyone who says NATO isn’t a threat to Russian interests is just delusional. It’s like they’re forgetting what the mission of NATO started as. That isn’t to say Russia’s goals are even 1% justified, but you do have to understand their PoV to understand why they decided to invade. Russia has always, and will always be an expansionist empire. NATO was specifically made to counter the Soviet Union’s aggression. And today’s Russia has basically the same foreign policy as the Soviet Union, except Soviet leaders were generally less rash than Putin.

It’s not hard to see how from an imperialist, revanchist view, NATO is preventing Russia from exercising control over its former sphere of influence. This is rather hypocritical for NATO to do, when the US is stationing tens of thousands of troops in Korea, Japan, and Germany. Russia thinks that the US is on a high horse preventing Russia from terrorizing small neighbouring countries while the US does the same thing across the planet.

danielisverycool

China sees it as NATO inching closer to Russia, justifying a pre-emptive strike from Russia. Same justification for China helping NK against US.

Nervous-Tangerine638

Basically, China is neutral and still ships dual purpose goods to US, Ukraine, and Russia.

So, they can continue their war efforts with each other, and China creates an opportunity to pull ahead.

random_agency

CCP should send their red guards to help Russia, they called it “长津湖第二！”

East-Lobster-6467

The chinese government probably secretly want Russia to be weakened.  It would give China the option to annex a huge swathe of land north and strengthen militarily close to the U.S. that's what I'd do.

Adogsbite

tshungwee

In short, Russia lack restraint, Ukraine lack brain to know where they are and what they are doing to join Nato. But it's expected as both Slavic ethnically thus same mentality.

mottscottison

Chinese people support Russian for the most part, they think the war is the result of nato provocation and generally sympathetic to Russia plight.  They do think russia shouldn't have invaded and waged the war, and think it is killing too many ukrainian, but they also think ukrain was too eager to be the west puppet.

100862233

The official media in China stays neutral. The neutrality means - pretty much similar with the situation of Switzerland before - China still does business with both countries and (not so actively) urges negotiations and ceasefire, saying that China can be a middle person if both want to sit down and talk.

The business are limited in civil products - but it doesn't mean you won't see them in wars. For example, it's been reported that civil DJI drones have been used by both sides at frontline. It's also true that Russia buys more chinese product than Ukraine due to multiple reasons like a) there are not available sellers for Russia after sanction, b) economical affinity before war time, c) Ukraine tends to use western products etc. 

People's opinion: roughly 60% pro russia and 30% pro Ukraine, 10% neutral.

Note that the proportion is changing with time. Many pro russia people don't really want Russia to win easily. They just want the war going on so that: 
a) Russia has no choice but rely on China more; 
b) NATO countries pay less attention to Asia and don't expand their organization to the far East.

Key_Edge_8841

yajusenpaii

Most people support Russia, while liberals support Ukraine. In China, those who support Russia also support Palestine, and those who support Ukraine also support Israel. The former group either opposes anything Western or unconditionally supports China's interests, while the latter unconditionally supports Western countries. Most Chinese people refer to the latter group as "self-colonizers.

OneNectarine1545

They unthinkingly believe what the propaganda allows them to think, like most political topics in China. Anyone who has “alternative opinions” learned to keep their trap shut a *long* time ago.

ButMuhNarrative

wow, I see pro Ukrainian comments being deleted in here by mods, not by users, by mods. they suddenly completely vanish. if this is true this sub is completely useless.

RangeBoring1371

Chinese look down on Russians - but hate Ukrainians . The love autocracy and hate democracy . China was humiliated when it had to adopt capitalism from the West to survive

giboauja

I remember watching news where ukrainians where saying : "Russia is going to attack? Noo, we are sister nations, we are friends, why would they attack us." next day I watched how ruzzian tank shot at civilians.

uitinis

Chinese state media like to say “Ukraine aggravated Russia, which made them attack”. This is the formal attitude of the Chinese government. CN align with russia to fight US, so they must say it in this way. 

Educated Chinese are not one sided pro-russia. Most of them view Russia as reckless, rough or even self-desctucting. While they do view Russia to be partner in Sino-US conflict, they also recognize that this is an alliance out of convenience. 

As for Ukraine, most of chinese doesnot have strong options. CN and Ukraine used to have a very good relationship, with intensive  military cooperations, but that is about 10 to 20 years ago. CN does not consider Ukraine as an enemy, but with current Sino-US relationship, there is really nothing much we can do.

Slow_Echo1478

most people view the west as negative foreign influence so they kinda sympathise with russia

Striking_Project7875

Ukrain ambassador to Japan visited the Yasukuni shrine on the day of defeats of imperial Japan on ww2, to "memorize the fallen soldiers protecting their home".

I won't say anymore.

Square_Bench_489

&gt; Wang was said to have given Kallas – the former Estonian prime minister who only late last year took up her role as the bloc’s de facto foreign affairs chief – several “history lessons and lectures”.
   
That’s how you can tell he’s a real socialist.

datums

So you're telling me Russia losing is a win-win-win...?

Puzzled_Animator_460

BATIRONSHARK

Is a Russian victory also that beneficial for China? The US will pivot from Ukraine all the same and you get a stronger, more independent Russia.

These comments from the Chinese FM will just give the Trump admin the extra impetus to dump Ukraine.

GlaberTheFool

&gt;Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi told the European Union’s top diplomat on Wednesday that Beijing cannot afford a Russian loss in Ukraine because it fears the United States would then shift its whole focus to Beijing, according to several people familiar with the exchange.


&gt;The comment, to the EU’s Kaja Kallas, would confirm what many in Brussels believe to be Beijing’s position but jar with China’s public utterances. The foreign minstry regularly says China is “not a party” to the war. Some EU officials involved were surprised by the frankness of Wang’s remarks.


&gt;Wang is said to have rejected, however, the accusation that China was materially supporting Russia’s war effort, financially or militarily, insisting that if it was doing so, the conflict would have ended long ago.


&gt;Some EU officials felt he was giving her a lesson in realpolitik, part of which focused on Beijing’s belief that Washington will soon turn its full attention eastward, two officials said.


&gt;One interpretation of Wang’s statement in Brussels is that while China did not ask for the war, its prolongation may suit Beijing’s strategic needs, so long as the US remains engaged in Ukraine.


&gt;The tone of Wednesday’s dialogue was said to be respectful, if tense. Nonetheless, some insiders were surprised by the harshness of Wang’s message, just three weeks out from an important leaders’ summit in China. Any appearance of a charm offensive is seen to have evaporated.


&gt;The sources said Wang told Kallas the two-day summit itself could be truncated – in a hint that Beijing is not happy with how the EU is positioning itself ahead of the event.


&gt;The bloc is set to blacklist two small Chinese banks for flouting its sanctions on Russia, in its 18th package of measures against Moscow, which is awaiting final approval from its 27 member states. On this point, Wang repeatedly vowed to retaliate if the lenders are ultimately listed.


&gt;It continues to take Beijing to task on trade matters, with dozens of investigations into subsidies, dumping and other market-distorting practices under way or in the works.


&gt;More recently, the sides clashed on Chinese restrictions on the export of rare earth elements and magnets, which have caused some European companies to stop manufacturing lines.


!ping UKRAINE&amp;FOREIGN-POLICY 

John_Maynard_Gains

“Europe will just pivot to embrace China”-actual upvoted opinion on this sub

obsessed_doomer

"My friend, Russia, is a little slow. Just let him win this round. It's important for his self esteem."

SheHerDeepState

CCP playing a multi-pronged gamble to simultaneously wreck the EU and weaken American power.

Between financing European political parties that weaken the united front policies of the EU when it comes to opposing China (think of removing any human rights reports regarding Chinese policies that may impact trade policy) to applying indirect military pressure via Russia, it's obvious that a weakening of the European bloc is a net benefit for China.

Tokidoki_Haru

I don’t care if Zelenskyy wins, I want Putin and Russia to lose

Sine_Fine_Belli

The timing of the leak (right after the US stopped sending some material to Ukraine) suggests it's a way to get Trump take the bait and start supporting Ukraine again. Let's hope he's as naive as Kallas thinks.

throwaway_veneto

Realpolitik koolaid

America's whole focus is already on China. 

China is failing to divert America's attention to Russia while suffering real costs to its relations with Europe.

What China could be doing is come aggressively together with Europe to promote solutions to climate change, join Europe in creating a new resolution body apart from the WTO(That the US froze), i.e, stepping into America's traditional role as a stabilizing force, at America's loss.

Boring-Journalist-14

https://preview.redd.it/fvuoakwzzvaf1.jpeg?width=1079&amp;format=pjpg&amp;auto=webp&amp;s=a436ba32285282aa44450823403d8901c1e3518c

Is there some brigading going on or was it just a change of settings? This was at hundreds of upvotes but when I check it now it's at 0?

Tropical2653

Lucky for China, western war aims are not a Russian loss.

Ukrainian war aims are total Russian defeat and Putin removed from power. Western governments do not support that. They only go as far as supporting some form of Ukrainian state that has some degree of political independence from Russia. Trump does not support a total break up of the Federated Russian states.

red-flamez

Multiple countries have knowingly and effortlessly been trying to steer the United States to support as many War zones as possible at once. This is just more bait on the hook. Whether Trump is dumb enough to take it is anybody's guess.

No I don't buy this because the more Russia continues to suffer from the war the better it will benefit China long term. The more the wound Russia causes itself during the war the more China will profit. Closing that wound after the war is over.

ProfessionalCreme119

I propose then China instead grow closer to the EU, help them eliminate Russia, and then both of them can focus their attention on the US under the current unhinged administration

Glavurdan

Can they tolerate Russia announcing that they won, and then the Russian Army goes home?

series-hybrid

That's funny, China typically makes a big deal about respecting other nations' "internal affairs".

GreedyNovel

That just makes me want to see Russia lose all the more.

Andovars_Ghost

China doesn’t want Russia to win outright, but it also cannot afford for it to lose. The best outcome for China is a prolonged conflict or a stalemate that:

Keeps the West distracted and divided,

Deepens Russia’s dependence on Beijing,

Undermines Western unity,

And preserves the current global power balance favorable to Chinese ambitions.

blackopal2

Maxfunky

In fact this is outright fake news.

What Wang Yi said was that China would be happy to see all parties play a constructive role in this regard and push for the conclusion of a comprehensive, lasting and binding peace agreement, so as to build a balanced, effective and sustainable European security architecture and to realize long-term peace and security in Europe at an early date.

[https://www.mfa.gov.cn/web/wjbz\_673089/xghd\_673097/202507/t20250704\_11664859.shtml](https://www.mfa.gov.cn/web/wjbz_673089/xghd_673097/202507/t20250704_11664859.shtml)

In other words, China hopes that the EU, Ukraine and Russia will reach a security framework.

And then this was interpreted as

"Some EU officials felt he was giving her a lesson in realpolitik, part of which focused on Beijing’s belief that Washington will soon turn its full attention eastward, two officials said. One interpretation of Wang’s statement in Brussels is that while China did not ask for the war, its prolongation may suit Beijing’s strategic needs, so long as the US remains engaged in Ukraine."

It's ridiculous.

bjran8888

lol this has been reposted daily - there's literally no video or audio of the minister saying this. It's heresay from an EU official based off a private conversation they supposedly had.

First_Helicopter_899

Keyword of the news: "**reportedly**".

Neither China nor EU officials has confirmed such words.

hextreme2007

TikTok was used to make people who use their platform desensitized to geopolitical issues where the West is the victim. Anyone I know who uses TikTok for geopolitics had 0 sympathy for Ukrainians, which was batshit insane when people were being harmed. Its intent is no better than Meta. Social media algorithms are used against us all.

542531

They could like... go home and leave Ukraine alone.

missed_sla

Strictly speaking, Russia doesn't need to lose. 

It simply needs to leave.

8livesdown

China only says that because of:

They buy discount oil and gas from russian and then sell products russia needs at premium.

China wants to buy historical land back.

China does not want US to shift their focus back to taiwan.

China is not an ally of russia - they are exclusively looking out for their own interests.

SutMinSnabelA

Well, all the information about this matter comes from an anonymous European diplomat, and this diplomat only revealed this one sentence from Wang Yi. What was the context of this statement, and what did the European diplomat themselves say? Yet, they have remained tight-lipped about it.  

"Good thing for me,that you opinion means ucazz' to me".  
Thats what EU should have said back.

kajokarafili

hkohne

Maybe China shouldn't have backed the country that invaded after signing a treaty saying they wouldn't ever invade again.

BookLuvr7

&gt; China's foreign minister tells EU that Beijing cannot accept Russia losing to Ukraine

This has just gotta be lost in translation; because it makes no sense. Russia loses nothing by Ukraine winning. In English this only works under the connotation Russia was under invasion. Russia is not defending, minister.

snowflake37wao

That's not what's in the video at all smh

Revolutionary_Bee251

Ukraine cannot accept Russia trying to torture and maiming their people.

SilverMonk777

What they can accept and what will happen are not necessarily the same thing.

JcbAzPx

Why is that? I can see no reason for this

robustofilth

So they should gaslight themselves about it

unematti

“Russia losing to Ukraine” what is that? When Ukraine invades Russia and murders and rapes its people?

No. Russia wouldn’t “lose” _anything_ if it left the land it has occupied since 2014. It doesn’t own those lands - it has occupied them. You don’t “lose” stolen goods if you’re forced to return them to their rightful owner.

Spongman

As Europe we should help and do everything we can to move production to other countries. FCK China government. Let's show them how we can play this too. MFs

It's not Ukraine only, as soon when they invade Taiwan, china will ask Russia and Belarus to attack Europe and it will happen. So they are not our friends.

advator

tehCharo

They could probably find someone easy to manipulate that is a Putin fan and help him get elected... oh wait!

InternetGamerFriend

Why would China say this? It doesn’t make any sense. Even with their own argument of if Russia loses America could turn its attention to China…. That sounds like some bs an American staffer would say

GolfIll564

Hmm. Trump can't seem to accept that, either.

Woody_L

did China's foreign minister really said that words？ or the EU believe he said？

reflyer

Is it China's fault, though? We need a new president to build relations with them.

DrankTooMuchMead

What china says and what china wants aren't always the same thing

extrastupidone

God way to ensure Europe will never trust China, even when the US disappear as the world leader

Kassdhal88

So they're scared that Russia's going to lose?

ItzLuzzyBaby

lol wat, who cares what they can and cannot accept? if they really can't accept it then go help instead of bitching.

ThatIslander

Chinese FM Wang Yi told EU leaders, including the bloc's top diplomat, that the PRC cannot afford a Russian loss in Ukraine because it would mean, in Beijing's view, that the US would thereafter turn its full attention to strategic competition with China.

SCMP scooped the minister's remarks and noted that they surprised multiple EU attendees, who long expected that the PRC wants the US to remain embroiled in the Ukraine War but had not heard Chinese officials say as much publicly or even privately.

Speaking personally as a US-based political scientist, this news will come as no surprise to the Trump Administration. In fact, IMO they could and perhaps will use this article as fodder to cite when they consider limiting additional military support to Kyiv.

Clarinetaphoner

This isn’t new information 

While China doesn’t need Russia as much as Russia needs China… China still needs Russia

ttown2011

Anybody with even a basic understanding of geopolitics knew this a long time ago. A Russian defeat in Ukraine would mean an end of Putin, possibility of a Russian collapse similar to Soviet Union, China will never allow that to happen, as that would open up their northern flanks.

PersonNPlusOne

What is a Russian loss?  Historian Victor David Hanson, a conservative with near daily YouTube  commentaries, made an interesting and perhaps valid point on the Ukraine war about 10 days ago, paraphrasing:

&gt;When the war in Ukraine began in February 2022, Russia already held Crimea, which it had annexed in 2014, and major parts of the Donbas region, specifically Donetsk and Luhansk.  Russia held 42,000 square kilometers. Since the start of the war, Russia has gained an additional 119,000 square kilometers, bringing the total occupied territory to  almost 27% of Ukraine.

&gt;A lot of this increase has come in the past year.  If Putin ends the war now, he has to explain to Russian elites and the general populace what was won at the cost an estimated 1 million Russian  casualties.  Is the additional 119,000 square kilometers that Russia has taken an adequate achievement?

Hanson argues that Russia has to achieve significantly more, either in terms of land taken or Ukrainian concessions such as not joining NATO, in order for Russia to feel that the war was not a botched enterprise.

Adeptobserver1

The mistaken assumption being that the current US administration actually cares about Ukraine. The other mistaken assumption being that Europe isn’t about to go balls to the wall on defence.

tresslessone

Wang Yi is incompetent, like the last Chinese FM. But part of the problem is that it’s increasingly difficult for China rectify its hostile foreign policy with its need to retain commercial and diplomatic ties to other developed nations. 

This war is largely already a strategic defeat for Russia. It retains control over the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant but aside from that will have economically and militarily exhausted itself in exchange for mostly strategically useless buffer territory. 

In the end even if Russia cannibalizes more Ukrainian territory, the cost will be too great for it to ever be worth it. The best Russia can hope for is a sort of Pyrrhic victory that it can sell its domestic population as a sort of reaffirmation of its Great Power status. In the end Russia will end up more diplomatically isolated and dependent on China than ever. 

Putin may convince himself that by prolonging the war he can stave off this outcome but I think there’s only so long he can stave off the inevitable. 

In any case for China, the United States is already fully shifting its priorities to East Asia and extricating itself from Europe. Had China played its cards differently it would have been in a position to exploit this and perhaps even drive a wedge in the Trans Atlantic alliance. But they overplayed their hand and there’s no turning back for them now.

ManOrangutan

And this is exactly why the US needs to be committed to forcing an end to the conflict through strength.  Make it clear to Russia that they cannot have Ukraine.

128-NotePolyVA

The EU should start realizing the high price of cheap goods, that could be sourced elsewhere, that they've been paying and will be paying, and make necessary adjustments. Russia feels comfortable doing what it does because China is where it is economically today, which has been result of the west allowing it to be latched on by the CCP for its market, capital, and tech. If you love the last 30 years of getting win-win'd, you are going to love the next 30.

Linny911

What do they mean by ”Russian loss” exactly?

marrow_monkey

\&gt; Beijing does not want to see a Russian loss in Ukraine because it fears the United States would then shift its whole focus to Beijing.

To a large extent, this is unsurprising. Somewhat similar to the Biden administration's sentiment that depleting and exposing Russia's conventional forces was in the US' interest. It's a second order effect, but straightforward and unsurprising for a superpower to think (and act) like this. But... being a second order interest... it is negotiable. 

To me this highlights the contrast: The EU's position, rhetoric and geopolitical "take."

The EU position has mostly been legalistic, moralistic, ideological: "*Russia's invasion violates international laws and is morally wrong.*" The position was not: "*Russia's invasion threaten's the EU and crosses its red lines."*  Europe has rarely expressed a perspective typical of global powers. No "vital security interests" for the EU.

Everyone would expect China to be *extremely* assertive if such a war, and territorial changes were made on its borders... near its borders or its maritime borders. That's a given.

Russia's "vital interests" near its border are also clear and reaction expected. Russia's security concerns may or may not be respected... but they are always unambiguous and articulated. We all know how assertive the *US* is about its vital interests. If the Ukraine war was in Mexico... all bets would be off.

*EU/Europe otoh.*.. Europe still seems to considers the whole concept of security interest illegitimate. It maintains a sort of "pseudo-judicial neutrality" in its rhetoric. Treats the war as a matter of justice, law and international norms. Seems to actively avoid frames that put its own security and interests at the centre of its position.

IMO... this is part of what led to this war. Russia sees Europe, and European NATO as an extension of the US. Not an independent power or rival with its own interests. In that frame, Ukraine was seen as much more of a Russian interest than an American one. This has proved half-right, as much of the US political spectrum says "*not our problem*."

European vital interests, red lines, geopolitical strategy... these were not considered. That's because they were never asserted.

Golda_M

Doesn't this, un-ironically, support Trump's plan/motivation to bring an end to this war, even if it costs Ukraine territory?

Not sure that is a good trade-off, fwiw.  But I'm also a bit worried about the world where China becomes (more?) expansionist.

timmg

Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi has expressed that China does not want to see Russia lose the ongoing war in Ukraine, fearing that such an outcome would redirect US attention towards Beijing. This statement marks a notable shift from China's previously stated neutrality concerning the conflict.

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